A Question about Typewriter Ribbons

[Shangas]

Hi Everyone!!

I'm one of the younger set here at the Lounge. But I'm old enough that I grew up learning to type on a typewriter...not a computer. And I've always had a strong fascination with mechanical typewriters. I think they're one of the coolest, most practical, and above all, most important inventions in the history of the world.

I keep thinking that I'd love to own one. But I have one issue. And for this, I have two questions:

How hard is it to find typewriter ribbons these days?

Is it possible to re-ink typewriter ribbons?

Although I'm not sure about the first question, from my reading, I've been led to understand that, with the right tools and the correct ink, which are pretty easily-obtained from any decent "office supplies" store, it is actually possible to re-ink, and reuse an old typewriter ribbon several times, so long as the ribbon itself is in good condition. From what I've seen and read, all you need is a bottle of stamp-pad ink, to resoak the ribbon and let the ink seep into the fabric. Apparently, typewriter ink and stamp-pad ink are of a similar enough consistency that they're almost interchangeable.

Is this true?

I ask because I've always thought typewriters were cool. I'd love to own and use one, but I keep wondering: "What do I do when the ribbon runs out?" There's always LOTS of typewriters for sale at my local flea-market and they go pretty cheap. I'd love to find a nice 1920s/30s portable, perhaps, and buy it and bring it home...but...the ribbons!...That's the issue...Educate me about them! Can they be re-inked practically? Can you still find them? Can you use some sort of substitute?

--- --- --- ---

Oh and while we're on the subject: If I *should* finally get the yen to buy a mechanical typewriter, what things should I check for before buying it?

How hard are typewriters to clean and oil to return them to full functionality? Is this something which I could do myself, provided that the typewriter itself is not actually damaged, but just old?

I'm familiar with a lot of the brands: Royal, Olivetti, Remington, Smith-Corona, I.B.M., etc...Any particular brands I should look for? Or will any typewriter by a major manufacturer suffice?

 

[LizzieMaine]

I've never had trouble finding generic ribbons at any office supply store, so I've never had the need to re-ink. It's certainly possible, but you'll look like a stoker by the time you're done, with black smudges everywhere.

Ribbons last a long time unless you're typing constantly. When I worked in radio, typing maybe fifty or sixty pages of copy a week, I used to have to change my ribbon once a year or so, so if all you're doing is casual correspondence you shouldn't have too much to worry about there.

There are online speciality retailers who sell model-specific ribbons for big money, but all these are are the same generic ribbons from the office supply store rewound onto vintage spools. You can easily do this yourself and save the extra money -- just invest in a bar of Lava soap or something like that to clean your hands off afterward.

Typewriter mechanisms are simpler than they look -- there's a spring motor escapement that moves the carriage, and a system of levers and springs to move the type bars. The most common problem you'll run into with these parts is bits of dirt, eraser crumbs, bugs, old oil, or other debris clogging up the works. I've had good luck flushing out these areas with naphtha -- which you can get anywhere as "Ronsonol Lighter Fluid." A bit of light oil -- sewing machine oil works fine -- at the joints keeps things working smoothly.

The biggest problem on any typewriter are the rubber rollers, which depending on how it's been used and stored will often dry up and develop flat sides. These need to be perfectly round to feed the paper properly, so if they're bad you'll need to replace them with good salvaged parts or have your originals resurfaced. There are places that do this, but they aren't inexpensive -- a search for "platen resurfacing" may bring up more information.

It's a good idea to keep your typewriter covered when you aren't using it. Dust is not your friend. And when you're not using it, release all the pressure on the rollers to keep flat spots from developing. Do these things, and your typewriter will outlive you.

As for models, the Royal Model 10 is the Model A Ford of the typewriter world -- simple, reliable, plentiful, and foolproof. Parts can be found without too much effort, and when cleaned and oiled and re-rubbered, they are very easy, satisifying machines to operate.

 

[Shangas]

Thanks awfully for such a detailed first reply, Lizzie!

I'm very used to dirty work and getting ink and grime on my hands. Don't forget that one of my hobbies is fixing fountain pens! So getting my hands covered in ink is an almost daily occurrence with me! Hahaha! Also, I clean out the fireplace in our living room during the winters, so having soot-black hands is nothing new. All that stuff doesn't phase me a bit.

I've got plenty of sewing-machine oil to lubricate any sticky or gunked up mechanisms, leftover from my restoration-project of my grandmother's Singer (which I think you're familiar with...I've used so much oil on that machine that it's almost silent now!). That's no concern.

I've read about issues with platens. Is there any particular reason why they're covered in RUBBER? Why not a purely plastic or metal platen? Is it to do with cushioning the strikes of the typebars or something?

I'll try find some way to cover my prize, when I get my hands on it.

This is the Royal Model 10:

It's a nice, solid, desktop-style typewriter...not QUITE what I'm after. I'm more likely to be chasing a smaller, more compact portable model (but we'll see what we'll see). How common were portable typewriters sporting full keyboards? (I know that some models skimped on the keys. For example, the '1' would be substituted with a capital 'I' instead, etc).

Keep the information coming!

 

[LizzieMaine]

Corona was the first really successful portable typewriter, and they were very common beginning in the twenties -- the earliest models had a type basket that you'd raise with a lever to use and then lower to fit in the case. making the mechanism a bit more complex than a common desktop machine. They're nice machines, but they can be easily knocked out of alignment.

If you want a good simple portable, the Royals, Underwoods, Coronas, and Remingtons of the thirties, forties, and early fifties are all good choices. The only drawback with portables is that they're more likely than office machines to have been stored in a hot attic, which can be lethal to the rubber parts. Inspect any machine you intend to buy carefully -- roll a piece of paper into it. It should go in smoothly, without any bumpy or uneven feeling.

I have a late-twenties Underwood portable I got when I was in high school, and it has a looser feel to it than an office machine -- doesn't take as much percussion from the fingers to type, and, in fact, if you type too hard on it it'll skip. All typewriters have their unique mechanical quirks that you have to learn in order to get the best results.


All typewriters, both office models and portables, that I've seen into the sixties lack the numeral "1" -- you just use the lower case L, and you quickly get used to it. They also lack the exclamation point, which you have to manufacture by typing an apostrophe, backspacing, and typing a period under it. Again, just something you get used to.

The platen needs to be live rubber to absorb the force of the type bar -- if you type on a hardened platen, the impression will spread because of the force not being absorbed, and the typing will be blurry and smudgy.

Keep in mind, too, that office machines were designed to type an original and a carbon copy, and they tend to hit with greater force than a portable, even when the pressure is adjusted (there's usually a small knob at the rear of the machine to make this adjustment.) For best results with an office typewriter, always make a carbon when you're typing -- or if you don't want to bother with a carbon, just roll a second sheet of paper into the machine along with your top sheet.

 

[Shangas]

I've heard about the issues regarding typebars, platens and paper. I knew a chap once who bought a typewriter. Everytime he used it, the hammers on the typebars were punching HOLES in his paper and he couldn't figure out why! I suspect that's a very extreme example, though.

If or when I do get a typewriter, I'd most likely use it for general typing. Drafts of stories, essays, general word-processing, and so-forth. All I need it to be is stylish, practical, easy to maintain and functional. Yes, I could use a computer, but I don't like having to wrestle with stuff like jamming paper, no ink, error-messages and all that crap (which trust me, my printer produces in frustrating abundance!). Everytime my printer rebels against me, I sit back, groan and think: "This would NEVER happen if I had a Royal on my desk..."

 

[LizzieMaine]

I've heard about the issues regarding typebars, platens and paper. I knew a chap once who bought a typewriter. Everytime he used it, the hammers on the typebars were punching HOLES in his paper and he couldn't figure out why! I suspect that's a very extreme example, though.

There's a couple of things that can cause that. First, check the ribbon position lever -- most typewriters had a setting for cutting mimeograph stencils, which brought the typebar against the paper at considerable force, without moving the ribbon into position, so the typebar struck the stencil sheet direct and cut an impression into it. A lot of inexperienced typists won't notice where this lever is set, and get holes in their paper as a result.

Second likely cause is either a hardened platen or trying to type a single sheet on an office machine -- the cure is to roll that second sheet of paper in with the first. It makes a very big difference.

If or when I do get a typewriter, I'd most likely use it for general typing. Drafts of stories, essays, general word-processing, and so-forth. All I need it to be is stylish, practical, easy to maintain and functional. Yes, I could use a computer, but I don't like having to wrestle with stuff like jamming paper, no ink, error-messages and all that crap (which trust me, my printer produces in frustrating abundance!). Everytime my printer rebels against me, I sit back, groan and think: "This would NEVER happen if I had a Royal on my desk..."

You'll find that you think more when typing on a real typewriter. You don't have the machine doing the work for you so far as corrections, alignment, etc. are concerned, and you have to be aware of these things as you're going. It's a very different process from working on a computer.

 

[Stanley Doble]

Printers have a special solvent they use to recondition the rubber rollers in their machines. I'm sure it would do the same for a typewriter. If you know a printer it can't hurt to ask.

As far as the stains go can I suggest rubber gloves?

I have a hunch there are millions of NOS typewriter ribbons around someplace. Typewriters went out of use so fast, office supply and stationary stores across the nation must have been stuck with millions of them. And as you point out as long as you can get ribbon of the right width you can rewind it on your old rollers.

 

[Shangas]

I was told on another forum that most ribbons came in a more-or-less standard 1/2 inch width, but that the spools upon which they were wound came in various sizes. That being the case, it's just a matter of unwinding the ribbon from the incorrect spool onto the spools already set into the typewriter, so that should be easy.

So my question now is:

What are the advantages/disadvantages (Pros and cons, if you will) of a portable Vs. desktop? Or vice-versa, as the case may be?

 

[LizzieMaine]

Portables -- well, they're smaller and easier to carry around, but they're not as sturdy as a desktop machine. In addition, they've often suffered more from poor storage, which makes it really important to check them over before buying. They also tend to be more expensive than ordinary desktop machines, because they're popular with "industrial design" enthusiasts and other such people who collect them to admire them on a shelf rather than using them. That drives the price up.

Desktop machines (or "Office Models," as they were known) tend to be much sturdier and much more reliable than portables. It's very common to find very old office typewriters that have already been completely rebuilt at least once -- it was very common to send one out to have it rebuilt when the parts began to wear out, so even if the serial number says it was made in, say, 1919, many of the working parts might be from the thirties, forties, or fifties -- and would have a lot of life left. My own Royal 10, built in 1923, was actually given a rebuild in the early seventies, so it's obvious these machines were intended to last and be used indefinitely.

The main disadvantage of office typewriters is the size and weight. A Royal Model 10 weighs over thirty pounds, so you'll either need a permanent place on the desk -- and it takes up a lot of space -- or one of those wheeled typewriter stands to rest it on.

I have a portable and an office model, which I use for different tasks. When I was a reporter I used to keep my portable in the car and used it to bang out copy on the spot to save time back at the office. I don't use it much now, but it's still there if I feel like taking it on a trip. My office model sits in my home office, and gets used for personal correspondence, addressing envelopes, filling in forms, and other such chores. Each machine is good for what it was designed to do.

 

[Shangas]

I've heard about how heavy old office machines can be. And that was the main deterrent to me getting one. I'm familiar with what 30+ pounds feels like! Gran's Singer weighs 32 pounds all up! And I've been lugging that around the house for the better part of three months, fixing it up!

In your heart-of-hearts, Liz, would you recommend a portable, or office machine? And what brands and models would be the best value and quality?

 

[LizzieMaine]

Well, it depends on what you intend to use it for. If it'll be used a *lot*, go with an office machine -- a Royal 10 will never disappoint you. I've also owned an L. C. Smith No. 5, from 1915, which worked smoothly and well, even though the shift lever is oddly placed on that model. Some people swear by Underwoods, but I've never owned one so I can't comment. Woodstock is a good make too (Alger Hiss thought so, anyway) but they're not as easy to find as Royals or Smiths. I've heard mixed reviews on Remingtons.

If you're just going to be typing occasionally, a good portable would be fine. Corona portables are the cream of the crop, but Royals and Underwoods are good too. Remington Noiselesses aren't as noiseless as the advertising claims, but that might just be that they need renovation.

 

[Shangas]

It's unlikely to be used REGULARLY, but when I DO use it, it's likely to encounter fairly heavy use. I forsee myself using it for things such as typing stories and novellas. I hate the fact that I have to type something on the computer, and then print it all out just to edit it and proofread it properly, when I can just type it onto a typewriter and do it that way instead...I dunno, maybe it seems counter-intuitive, but that's what I'd be using it for.

I had a typewriter once before, an electric Canon Typestar (I dare you to look it up on Google Images!), and I used that virtually until the day it died from exhaustion-through-overwork to type out stories.

 

[Vornholt]

Finally, a thread where I have something to contribute.

I second Lizzie's comments on the change you'll see when using a typewriter. Without that all too easy "delete" function, you're forced to slow down, to think more about what you're writing. I do this myself, even when typing radio scripts from longhand notes. Of course, I have one of the largest collections of correction film in captivity, too.

I have Royals, myself. A fully reconditioned and re-rubbered 1936 KHM is setting next to me as I'm typing, with an equally up-to-snuff Model 10 in the next room. I have a reconditioned Quiet Deluxe portable that I used for many pages before the office models came in. Ribbons are not a big deal, but I tend to get mine pre-rolled (Sorry, Lizzie!) as I hate ink stains. I find them solid, reliable, and unlike my company issued laptop, they do not require reboots and operating system upgrades.

I have some information on platen re-covering, an important topic as the main supplier of that service has just closed up their business. PM me if you want more information, or I can organize what I have and post it here.

 

[p51]

Here are a few observations I've made on period typewriters:

• Buy ones that are already in good condition and work well. It's better to pay more up front and have a good working machine than get junk because there are so few people who work on them now.
• always open up the cover and check for function before buying. Flip it over and see if there's any rust under there. I've seen plenty of "great looking" ones that were rusted badly underneath and you couldn't tell otherwise. If it's a portable, take it out of the case before buying it.
• Re-inking a ribbon sucks. I did once for someone with an original German war-era ribbon he had to use on his original machine. It's messy and rarely works as well as a factory ribbon. You can easily gum a ribbon up badly if you do it wrong.
• If it's a portable, keep it closed in the case when not using it. It keeps the ribbon from drying out as fast.
• My Mom always insisted that you had to put another piece of paper behind the one you're typing onto so you don't ding up the platen (that rubber-covered roller the paper passes over). I have owned lots of original typewriters over the years and have never seen the marks she talks about, but some others swear by this.
• Get the manuals for your machine if you can. Originals are nice, but lots of them have been scanned online or reproductions can be bought cheaply. They give you hints you might never think of.
• Military-marked ones from WW2 are quite valuable. Buy one if you encounter it if it's a good price, especially US Army-marked ones and any German ones with the "SS" key.

 

[Shangas]

Buy ones that are already in good condition and work well. It's better to pay more up front and have a good working machine than get junk because there are so few people who work on them now.
always open up the cover and check for function before buying. Flip it over and see if there's any rust under there. I've seen plenty of "great looking" ones that were rusted badly underneath and you couldn't tell otherwise. If it's a portable, take it out of the case before buying it.

I'm aware of the issues regarding repairs and suchlike. Bearing that in mind, I only intend to buy a typewriter that's already in functioning condition. Cleaning out dust, adding oil, polishing, I don't mind. But anything that requires major repairs is definitely not on my "To Buy" list!

 

[Shangas]

I went out walking today, and I stumbled across these two typewriters in a shop:

Obviously, I'm nowhere NEAR making a purchase yet...but...the Imperial typewriter is kind of like the style I'm looking for. But the no-name one (at least, no name that I could see!) looks to be in better condition (and it's about 1/3 the price of the Imperial!). All it had on it was "Made in England"...Anyone know what manufacturer would've made that second typewriter? I searched all over it, I couldn't see a maker anywhere. And in my limited experience, names are usually emblazoned across the front of the machine...

After much reading and picture-looking and video-watching, I've narrowed down possible candidates. So far, the one/s that I'd consider are...

ROYAL Model. O.:

ROYAL Portable:

Royal Model 10:

I'm seriously considering either the 'O' model or the Portable. Any feedback and insight into these models would be greatly appreciated, as well as the Model 10. If there are any other likely candidates, feel free to post them.

 

[Vornholt]

The Model 10 will not let you down, ever, if it's kept up, but she'll want a nice, solid place on a desk or rolling stand.

I've never owned a portable quite as old as the two you've listed, but my experience with later models suggests they'd serve well, particularly for infrequent use as you described.

 

[Shangas]

The Royal 10 looks really neat, but it's the issue of the weight. It's for that reason that I was a bit more drawn towards the Model O. Can anyone comment on their +s and -ses?

 

[Mr Vim]

Lizzie, going over what you said on the first page... office supplies stores have ribbons that can be used on typewriters? I'm getting one now.

 

[LizzieMaine]

You should be able to find a "universal ribbon" in any office-supply place. You'll probably need to wind the ribbon onto the spools that come with your typewriter to get it to fit properly -- wear rubber gloves to do this, it's a messy job.

If you have small, local independent office store that's been around a while, you might actually be able to buy ribbons already on spools to fit your machine. These will likely be old stock, but they'll be sealed in plastic or wrapped in foil so they should still be good.