Single breasted peak lapel

[Matt Deckard]

Gary Cooper 1930
2 button single breasted peak lapel

Next time I say I'm getting a suit made, remind me that this is what I want.

 

[Dr. Shocker]

its a good looking coat....I see them in the thrift stores occasionally.....but never when I have $$$$

 

[scotrace]

Working on it.

Don't hold your breath, but I'm making the contacts and doing the homework to have this and similar styles produced. Should have linen handkerchiefs available soon.

 

[Kentucky Blues]

Cool....my 40's suit is single breasted peaked lapeled, but its 3 button.... I generally prefer 3-button, but in the single breasted with peak lapels variety, I think the two button looks better, now that I've seen these pics. Maybe one of these days I'll find one.....

 

[Mycroft]

I have a similar suit in a navy blue shadow stripe with three buttons, they are very comfortable and good for long, drawn out parties.

 

[Matt Deckard]

If I have a peak lapel suit made I think I may go for a three button with patch pockets belted back and center pleated biswing. If you look at the picture at the top you will notice that the suit is snug and hugging the body; that is how I want my suits to fit. As long as the armholes are cut high the suit will feel like wearing a shirt.

 

[Matt Deckard]

Please check out this thead.

http://www.thefedoralounge.com/showthread.php?t=1305&highlight=arm+hole

And read this, I wrote it a while back.

I think the whole world believes that a bigger armhole is more comfortable. Sure it makes a jacket easier to put on but it makes the jacket much harder to wear.

Not even made to measure can do a good job in making a smaller armhole nowadays. You need to get a good custom suit if you want to have a jacket that can be worn like Connery wore his in the early Bond films... Connery could stick his arms over his head and the jacket would barely rise. Today you stick your arms out to drive a car and you have wool touching the back of your head.

If you watch the old Connery Bond films you will see that Connery has no trouble doing heavy tasks in his suit, whether it be sitting on the ground clapping to a belly dancer or fighting a spy on a train or hanging from a moving vehicle, when his arms are raised the jacket rises little if any. If you watch Cary Grant in North By North West you will see the same thing... watch these moveies and you'll see what I mean.

Now compare that to Brosnan as Bond in the new films and you will see that Brosnan has to remove his jacket to do anything really taxing. His suits are custom made by Brioni, though the armholes are cut lower and when he moves the suit rides up and heads for the back of his head. Never comfortable.

Vintage suits from the 60's may be harder to put on, though because their armholes were cut higher into the armpit you had more maneuverability. I hope this all makes sense.

If you want a better example with clothes sold currently, find a store that sells Ralph Lauren Blue Label Polo suits. The armholes on those jackets are higher cut like those in the 50's and 60's, then compare the fit of the Polo suit to that of a jacket you can find at JC Penny's and you will see a marked difference.

I know all the measurements are important for a well fitting suit, though to me the armhole measurement is probably the most important. You can see the difference in how suits fit the men in the movies in the 1930's (more my forte) versus how they fit today as well -- Clark Gable in It Happend one Night; He raise his arms and the jacket stays put.

I'll try to get some Bond and Steed screen grabs to give you a better idea of what I mean. Suits aren't meant to be uncomfortables as they are today. they were a spin off of the military uniform, and those were made for maneuverability and fit. Today's suits are made for drape and people buy two sizes too big.

 

[scotrace]

Posted to wrong thread - here too

Today you stick your arms out to drive a car and you have wool touching the back of your head.

Yes! I find I am constantly tugging a jacket off my neck when sitting. Also, when the jacket is buttoned, the incorrect armhole construction causes - especially if you have broad shoulders - a small horizontal pinch between the shoulder blades, and the front becomes what an old friend used to call "powter pigeony."

 

[Vladimir Berkov]

Another thing affecting freedom of movement in the suit is how much and what type of padding is used for the shoulders. My favorite coat is an older Ralph Lauren polo unconstructed sportcoat which has basically no padding whatsoever on the shoulders, and fairly small armholes.

When I wear it, it feels like I am wearing a shirt almost. Of course, the fact that it is unconstructed means that it doesn't drape quite as well as a real canvassed coat, but as a spring/summer sportcoat it works wonderfully.

 

[BellyTank]

The Armhole thing...

The Armhole thing...
Cheap or 'average suit jackets' have armoles(sleevehead) that end lower on the jacket body, which can give a kind of 'Bat-wing' effect- when you lift your arms, you're pulling the body of the jacket up- if the armholes extend low, you're pulling a big bunch of jacket up- if they're higher, you're pulling the whole jacket up a little.
BUT it also depends of course, on how tight the jacket fits in the body.
Imagine for a moment, that it's not a suit jacket but a long sleeved T-shirt, now lift your imaginary arms- now imagine the effect if the arm holes reached to half way down the shirt- you'd be easily exposing your belly.
Another phenomenon in vintage jackets, which is exaggerated in catalog illustrations, as above, is the combination of shoulder width and armhole/sleevehead height- sometimes the armhole is slightly 'outboard' of the jackets chest. You notice this on the wide shouldered '40s jackets.
Imagine this effect compared to where the sleevehead is set further in to the jacket torso. The point where you arms articulate from inside the jacket-
This can be a tough thing to explain...

I hope this explanation has gone a bit further-

B
T

 

[scotrace]

Nice Sleeve-talk

BellyTank, you are good.

I understood this concept before, but you make it very easy to visualize.

I want a suit just like the drawing. even if I look like Mothra in it.

This one is tempting to buy and have reverse-engineered and copied. But it's not quite "it." It's also made for a stubbier fellow than I:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=52388&item=8302711616&rd=1

 

[jamespowers]

This one is tempting to buy and have reverse-engineered and copied. But it's not quite "it." It's also made for a stubbier fellow than I:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=52388&item=8302711616&rd=1

Hey, hey! That just might fit me. The pants are a bit big but the coat is about right.
The suit has quite a low gorge for a 40s suit though. Are you sure it is from the 40s? That fashion plate of the peaked lapel has a much higher gorge than the suit in that auction. My 40s suit coats also seem quite a bit higher than that---although they are all double breasted. Just a thought.

Regards to all,

J

 

[BellyTank]

Scotrace- I agree with James-
If that jacket is '40s,... well, it's not quite '40s enough to use as an example
to copy from.
Maybe keep your eyes peeled for a better example.

B
T

 

[scotrace]

exactly

It's not "it" at all. I think it's bringing 100+ because it's an H-F. The loops on the pants are dropped, but that's about all that is interesting for me.
It would be much easier if there were patterns.

 

[SHARPETOYS]

I want one.

Don't hold your breath, but I'm making the contacts and doing the homework to have this and similar styles produced. Should have linen handkerchiefs available soon.

I want hold my breath but I hope the plan comes together. I will be one of your first customers. Save a 48R please!!

 

[scotrace]

Nursing Home

I want hold my breath but I hope the plan comes together. I will be one of your first customers. Save a 48R please!!

At the rate I'm going, you and I will be able to look really snappy as we shuffle down the hallway with our walkers to eat our creamed strained banana dinner by the time I have anything to offer.

Looking nice means we'll be able to get away with pinching the nurses though.

Thanks for the confidence!

 

[sandysot]

Pointed Lapels- A clue?

In my rounds of the thrift stores now & then I see jackets or suits with pointed lapels.Not just wide lapels, but ones that point up and out.I know they were used in the forties,which is the period of my interest, but I also saw a Hugo Boss DB jacket in an Exorcist vomit green with the same lapel treatment.Had to be from the nineties.
My question came from seeing a 3pc. DB suit that was a caramel color heavy weight plaid hard gabardine or worsted like the kind my father wore in the forties-fifties.Im not too good with fabric I.D. It had padded shoulders, a flap change pocket, a micro zipper. and a five button vest.Would a zipper of that type have been used in the fifties or would it be more likely that the suit dates from the sixties or later?Cant take pictures without either buying it or raising curiosity.Are the lapels a tipoff to good 40-50 vintage?Is the zipper from a later time?
Appreciate any info.

Sandy

 

[android]

You've got three basic types of lapels on jackets. notch, Peak and shawl.

A double breasted jacket should always have peak lapels, period.

Tuxedo should have either a shawl or a peak. Many manufacturers are now selling tuxedos with notch lapels. This is because they are cheap and don't want to change out the machinery to the correct lapel style in the factory.

A single breasted suit can have either peak or notch. Peak is considered fancier and that is why you see it on more vintage suits. Notch is cheap and easy and that is why it is the prefered lapel on modern manufactured suits.

You may starting to see notched lapels on double breasted. These are abominations.

 

[Matt Deckard]

M

Whether or not a suit has peaked lapels is not a reliable way to date a suit. Peaked lapel on single breasted short jackets (when compared to a frock coat or cuttaway coat) have been around since before the 1900's and have continued 'til today. Popularity has waned now and again though the style has never dissapeared at any point.

A better way to tell if a suit is older would be from tags inside the pockets, what material the suit is made of, how many pockets are in the jacket, how the jacket is constructed, does it have a skeleton lining, are the armholes smaller than modern and the shape and size of the lapels. Plastic zipper to me indicates it is from after the 60's.

 

[Wild Root]

Good point Matt! If you know your lapels, then you could maybe date it seeing that some of the vintage that I have, has pointed, straight lapels and some others I have, have some what rounded lapels on my DB suits. The cut is also very important and so is the fabric. Zippers from the start to the 60's were all metal. Plastic zippers are a sure sign of a late 60's early 70's suit. Fabric is also a big tip off to a vintage. Just hold a vintage suit in your hand and you'll feel the weight! they're heavy!

So, hope this helps. 1936 Sears catalog page.

Root.