Help Determining Buco Model Please

[john z]

A few months ago I bought a Horsehide 'D' Pocket Buco. It has the quilted rayon(?) lining as opposed to the wool of the J22 & I assumed it is a J23.

The problem is I have another Buco which, although nowhere near as nice in condition, at 1st appears the same. I have since noticed the 2nd jacket has far shorter sleeve zips. Also the stitching that runs around the cuff-end of the sleeves to prevent the lining pushing out of the sleeve is much nearer the sleeve end than the 1st. There may be other differences upon close inspection which I have not yet bothered with.

Did the J23 have specifications changed during its production or is it likely that these variations are because the 2 jackets are different models? For example could 1 be a J24 & what is the difference between the 2 designations?

Any help would be most appreciated people

 

[HDRnR]

Were they both made in Detroit ?

 

[Rufus]

Hi John, got any photos..?

Sounds like you've got a j23 (I've owned a few), but photos would help to clarify..

There were some minor variation, including some models having a small stitched halfbelt, and later models having halfbelts. (And cheaper steerhide models)

rufus

 

[jamespibworth@n]

Hi John,

Although I may not be able to help with your question I too would like to see some pictures of your Bucos.

Cheerio

James.

 

[john z]

Thank for the replies chaps, much appreciated.

Were they both made in Detroit ?

I don't know but if the labels are any indication then yes as they both have the Horsehide logo with word Detroit embroidered.

Hi John, got any photos..?

Sounds like you've got a j23 (I've owned a few), but photos would help to clarify..

There were some minor variation, including some models having a small stitched halfbelt, and later models having halfbelts. (And cheaper steerhide models)

rufus

Hi Rufus

Pics below.

How do you know if it's a J23 or J24 as they are very similar aren't they?

No half-belts on these but loops to accept a non-integral belt. Both are Horsehide.

Hi John,

Although I may not be able to help with your question I too would like to see some pictures of your Bucos.

Cheerio

James.

Hi James

Here's some pics for you. Thanks for your interest.

This one's in need of some TLC. New main zip required. Bought a sprung Crown from Mash which I may or may not use. 'D' pocket zip has at some time been replaced & the replacement is upside down, ie the puller is at the top when closed. Needs some worn stitching replacing, particularly that at the cuff ends that prevents the lining hanging out.





This one's much better & has no problems at all. 100% original in amazing condition for its age.




This shows the difference in sleeve zip lengths & the distance up from the cuff of the lining retaining stitching.


The lining of the better jacket.


These leather tags are on all the front zip pulls of the better jacket.


So what do you know guys, are they both J23s & why the sleeve detail difference?

 

[Rufus]

The sleeve stitching on the J23 that I have is like your higher one.

It's a small detail... They're both J23s! I'm sure over the many years of production you'll find minor differences. I've also seen some with scooped tails on the back of the jacket, like a Schott, too better cover your lower back when riding.

The J22 was wool lined, hence the change in designation. Apart from that, pretty much the same.

I've got some spare studs somewhere for the epaulettes... I'll see if I can find them for you..

Ruf

 

[john z]

The sleeve stitching on the J23 that I have is like your higher one.

It's a small detail... They're both J23s! I'm sure over the many years of production you'll find minor differences. I've also seen some with scooped tails on the back of the jacket, like a Schott, too better cover your lower back when riding.

The J22 was wool lined, hence the change in designation. Apart from that, pretty much the same.

I've got some spare studs somewhere for the epaulettes... I'll see if I can find them for you..

Ruf

Hi Rufus

Thanks for the informative reply.

I assume the sleeve zip length change is a spec change during the J23's production run then.

I've seen them with the 'Ducks Arse' back too but assumed that was a later innovation. I prefer the straight back & have never owned a bike in my life. My time on two wheels was strictly Lambrettas ironically.

Was the J24 a completely different model rather than a development of the J23?

That's very kind of you to see if you could find a pair of the missing epaulette bars. I'd gladly exchange them for some beer tokens. The ones on the 2nd jacket were originally on the 1st jacket. That they were missing from the better jacket was its only fault so I moved them from 1 to the other.

Cheers
John

 

[jonbuilder]

I belive both your jackets as J-24s. to my understanding J-23s and J-22 had one rear map pocket only J-24 had the two rear map pockets

 

[Rufus]

Hi Jon, they all had 2 rear passenger pockets (They're supposed to be for a passenger putting they're arms around you, not maps).

They are J23s I believe!

Ruf