Calling out The National Guard (Pennsylvania) circa early 1900s

[deanglen]

Those sheriff hats and trooper hats are essentially campaign hats and make great conversions, depending on the era one is looking at. pre-1911, I would go for 5/8" grograin and the bow which I have only seen on the pre-1911 campaign hats. Post 1911 would pretty much require only a pretty triangular montana peak, or "smokey" peak, like your old DI wore. Pat H. is my authority for the M1911 hat. I lean backward to the Frontier Army/Span-Am War era hats.

dean

 

[Prairie Shade]

Stratton Owns Winchester Right?

I BELIEVE all of mine are quality felts. I have 3 campaigns, and 2 sheriff styles, one a black straw. It is a Milan type weave with satin sweatband which I favor in hot weather. All have taken some abuse and stood up admirably. Akubra shrinks when wet and dried, these guys dont want to move at all. I re-shape them into a slouch style, put a cord on with a nape strap. Come on wind!! The campaigns I pull the front and back down to take some of the DI thing away. Looks more like a soldier's hat would have looked out in the weather. I have no complaints!! Buy away there are about 16 listed on the "bay"

 

[Prairie Shade]

Post Script

I assume you fella's know that the Black Hat with Yellow Hat cord IS authorized headgear for the Cavalry now. Just thought I would throw that in since there has been some discussion about changing military headgear. Most Troopers have one I BELIEVE.

 

[Mojave Jack]

Those sheriff hats and trooper hats are essentially campaign hats and make great conversions, depending on the era one is looking at. pre-1911, I would go for 5/8" grograin and the bow which I have only seen on the pre-1911 campaign hats.

Dean, did you see the upcoming special on the Span-Am War on the History Channel? Tuesday night, 9 Eastern.

Did the earlier campaign hats have bound brims, or was only officer's? The specifications for the M1883 and the M1889 don't seem to specify, but I've seen both bound and unbound. How common was the edge stitching? I've debated whether or not I could bind a brim by hand. It doesn't seem like it'd be that difficult; it would just take a lot of patience! The edge stitching, on the other hand, would require a sewing machine that could handle that. Can a standard machine punch through a thick felt like that?

Also, how hard would it be to put in the screen vents? I assume you just make the hole where you want it, and the screen vents snap together from each side. Or is that hopelessly naive?

I BELIEVE all of mine are quality felts. I have 3 campaigns, and 2 sheriff styles, one a black straw. It is a Milan type weave with satin sweatband which I favor in hot weather. All have taken some abuse and stood up admirably. Akubra shrinks when wet and dried, these guys dont want to move at all. I re-shape them into a slouch style, put a cord on with a nape strap. Come on wind!! The campaigns I pull the front and back down to take some of the DI thing away. Looks more like a soldier's hat would have looked out in the weather. I have no complaints!! Buy away there are about 16 listed on the "bay"

That's good to hear. I would think that a hat being worn in all conditions would be of good quality; at least if I had to wear one all the time I'd want the best I could get! lol I've got my eye on one in particular, so we'll see! Do you ever see tham in the tan/brown shade that would make a good M1883 or M1889? What search terms do you use? I tried "Stratton hat "but only got a few. This thread has really inpsired me to put together a Marine Corps ensemble circa 1897. I'll have to do some more research on all the various bits, though.

I'm also thinking about one of the straw Strattons as a good summer alternative in the field here. Are they very shapeable, or are they very stiff?

 

[Prairie Shade]

A Little Steam!!!

The Sheriffs hat comes with the stupid looking (IMO) upturned brim. I just steamed it and turned it down to a slouch hat. I added a yellow cord (thats for me ,cavalry you know) and a nape strap. It is very nice in the heat and looks very nice. I have the black version and I like it very much. It seems nicely vented and much cooler than the felt version.

 

[Mojave Jack]

Dang! I let a brand new one in my size go by because the seller never answered my e-mail questions. Oh, well, I'll keep my out out for the next one, I guess.

 

[Prairie Shade]

Just be patient

They come and go by the dozen, or at least they have until now. In a week or so you'll find what your looking for.

 

[deanglen]

Dean, did you see the upcoming special on the Span-Am War on the History Channel? Tuesday night, 9 Eastern.

Did the earlier campaign hats have bound brims, or was only officer's? The specifications for the M1883 and the M1889 don't seem to specify, but I've seen both bound and unbound. be that difficult; it would just take a lot of patience! TheHow common was the edge stitching? I've debated whether or not I could bind a brim by hand. It doesn't seem like it'd edge stitching, on the other hand, would require a sewing machine that could handle that. Can a standard machine punch through a thick felt like that?

Also, how hard would it be to put in the screen vents? I assume you just make the hole where you want it, and the screen vents snap together from each side. Or is that hopelessly naive?


That's good to hear. I would think that a hat being worn in all conditions would be of good quality; at least if I had to wear one all the time I'd want the best I could get! lol I've got my eye on one in particular, so we'll see! Do you ever see tham in the tan/brown shade that would make a good M1883 or M1889? What search terms do you use? I tried "Stratton hat "but only got a few. This thread has really inpsired me to put together a Marine Corps ensemble circa 1897. I'll have to do some more research on all the various bits, though.

I'm also thinking about one of the straw Strattons as a good summer alternative in the field here. Are they very shapeable, or are they very stiff?

Mojave,

Here are the best answers I can give. This is a link to the Society of the Military Horse Forum. Pat H., a Lounger, is a member of it. This is a thread that includes some great photos and info on original Span-Am War hats and early 1900s.
http://www.militaryhorse.org/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=7091&SearchTerms=Campaign,hat

Q.Did the earlier campaign hats have bound brims, or was only officer's?
A. As far as I know, mostly Officers.


Q.How common was the edge stitching?
A.From the M1876 to the M1911, edge stitching of various numbers of rows was a common feature. Three rows through the M1899, After that two rows, until the M1911 "Montana Peak" whaich had as man as five closely spaced rows of stitching.

Q.It doesn't seem like it'd be that difficult; it would just take a lot of patience! The edge stitching, on the other hand, would require a sewing machine that could handle that. Can a standard machine punch through a thick felt like that?
A. I tried hand edge stitching two hats I worked on. It takes patience, and you have to figure out a way to imitate a chain stitch which is what a machine produced. The stitches, viewed up close, often were not even, or in a nice straight line. I wasn't satisfied with my efforts. I tried a sewing machine. It works, but if the felt is too stiff, the machine might get hung up, requiring adjustment, slowing the process. But, it's a much better way to do it and really, the only way to reproduce an original.


Q. I've debated whether or not I could bind a brim by hand.
A. Yes you can; I have done it on four hats. You need to make very tight, close little stitches and keep the ribbon tight, positioning as you go. Give yourself about six hours for one hat. Your hands will be sore, but you will be happy with your work. I did one for Doc Holliday which I hope he posts shots of once he gets it in the mail.


Q.Also, how hard would it be to put in the screen vents? I assume you just make the hole where you want it, and the screen vents snap together from each side. Or is that hopelessly naive?
A. Nver puy any in, but your impression seems to make sense.


Q.Dean, did you see the upcoming special on the Span-Am War on the History Channel? Tuesday night, 9 Eastern.
A. No, but I will now! Thanks, MJ!

dean

 

[Davidson]

Misc comments

I could have sworn I posted a reply in this thread before...anyway:

1. As far as I know, Stratton still owns Winchester in TN, a source of excellent felt (Art uses them, I think). BUT they say on their web site that the current production service hats (not western hats) use imported felt. Stratton do custom, so a 30x pure beaver in the style 42 is probably easily done - but also probably $300.

2. My wife says that she needs to adjust the tension on the bobbin and needle to get a decent stitch, and if she was going to do it much, she'd get some different needles. But, she says her Viking has the capability to sew edge binding just fine. It's a high-end machine, but still "standard", not industrial or special purpose.

 

[deanglen]

I could have sworn I posted a reply in this thread before...anyway:

2. My wife says that she needs to adjust the tension on the bobbin and needle to get a decent stitch, and if she was going to do it much, she'd get some different needles. But, she says her Viking has the capability to sew edge binding just fine. It's a high-end machine, but still "standard", not industrial or special purpose.

Davidson,

Does that mean she could do edge stitching as well, given that felt is pretty thick. I was tempted to take a hat to shoe repair place for some edge stitiching because I figure they have machines that if they can sew leather, felt should be a snap!

dean

 

[Davidson]

Davidson,

Does that mean she could do edge stitching as well, given that felt is pretty thick. I was tempted to take a hat to shoe repair place for some edge stitiching because I figure they have machines that if they can sew leather, felt should be a snap!

dean

Yes. She has experimented with sewing through some of my western hat felt, and it took a few minutes, but soon she was satisfied. It's not as tough to sew as leather of the same thickness. But I think you have to know how to adjust the machine to suit the material, and pick the right needle. By that I mean I can't do it, but she can

 

[deanglen]

Yes. She has experimented with sewing through some of my western hat felt, and it took a few minutes, but soon she was satisfied. It's not as tough to sew as leather of the same thickness. But I think you have to know how to adjust the machine to suit the material, and pick the right needle. By that I mean I can't do it, but she can

Well then, I just might be forwarding a hat or two for some edge stitching work when the time is right. I'll be in touch! Thanks for your input in this thread!

dean

 

[Mojave Jack]

A cobbler! Dean, that's brilliant! I know my cobbler, Del, pretty well, and he has done some work on my leather hat bands. I'll bet his machine could put in the edge stitching with no problem. I'll have to ask him about that.

Thanks for all the great info, too. I actually joined the Society of the Military Horse Forum about six months or a year ago, but keep forgetting about it. Now if I can remember what my password is... :eusa_doh:

 

[deanglen]

I assume you fella's know that the Black Hat with Yellow Hat cord IS authorized headgear for the Cavalry now. Just thought I would throw that in since there has been some discussion about changing military headgear. Most Troopers have one I BELIEVE.

Then they should wear it...all the time! I'd want the infantry in their Campaign hats, too, with the blue infantry cord. Listen to me, a guy whose military service amounted to one year in the Civil Air Patrol! For petes's sake! :eusa_doh:

dean

 

[Prairie Shade]

Not in the Field

The Military usually requires a Pot or now I guess Kevlar when actually in operations. The Black Hat is worn in garrison I believe. Anyone out there at Ft. Hood? If so, fill us in!!!!

 

[deanglen]

The Military usually requires a Pot or now I guess Kevlar when actually in operations. The Black Hat is worn in garrison I believe. Anyone out there at Ft. Hood? If so, fill us in!!!!

Duh!:eusa_doh: I guess I was only thinking garrison, etc. Totally forgot about combat[huh] Forgive me, I'm a civillian.

dean

 

[Davidson]

Misunderstanding, maybe.

Well then, I just might be forwarding a hat or two for some edge stitching work when the time is right. I'll be in touch! Thanks for your input in this thread!

dean

Hi Dean,

I was passing on my wife's comments about what she found her sewing machine could do, as a person with some sewing experience (I have none). She's not interested in taking on any work, sorry for any misunderstanding. And you're welcome.

 

[deanglen]

Hi Dean,

I was passing on my wife's comments about what she found her sewing machine could do, as a person with some sewing experience (I have none). She's not interested in taking on any work, sorry for any misunderstanding. And you're welcome.

Davison,

That's cool! But if she changes her mind...LMK

dean

 

[Prairie Shade]

Cavalry Hats - Ft Hood TX

 

[Prairie Shade]

Another Shot