Black Knox 20 Custom Edge in 7 3/4 Long Oval (help with odor!)

[MattJH]

This is my second black hat, the first being a 2" bound brim NOS Barbisio. I couldn't pass this one up because it was a stingy Knox 20 and the size was fairly rare; I was curious to see how it would fit on me. To my surprise, I'm fairly certain now that I am not a 7 5/8 but rather a 7 3/4 LO (unless the hat shrunk over the years). It fits me better than any other hat I own. Not only does the hat have a wind trolley, but the button at the end has the Knox logo embroidered in it. I never knew they branded the wind trolley buttons!

Here's the problem: the Knox box has very obvious water damage and the hat smells like it was kept in a mildewy, moldy, musky basement ever since it was manufactured. It's brutal. I already emailed the seller requesting partial monetary reimbursement as there's no way I would've paid upwards of $50 (including shipping) if I had known this. It was not accurately detailed in the description. At the same time, if there's a chance that this hat could be un-smelled, I'd love to keep it.

Help?

Here are photos:

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[MattJH]

I just received this response:

"My wife is in the hospital and will not be able to answer right away. I will talk to her tonight regarding your issues."

Isn't it amazing just how many sellers on eBay are in and out of hospitals? I know that sounds callous and uncaring, but seriously now, the ratio of this occuring is staggering.

 

[LEUII]

I don't know if this will help or not, but I was given a Mackinaw that had been stored in a basement. It smelled to high heaven. I contacted a company that dealt with fire restoration and water damage. They referred me to a cleaner that they used. They were able to 'fumigate' it and it is fine now.

 

[feltfan]

I have also noted the relative lack of health among eBay sellers.
But then again, I suspect that those selling vintage items may
skew the average age...

Anyway, I suggest sun, sun, sun. Put it in a sunny spot for
a couple of weeks. Brush it regularly. Sun the inside and
the outside. Not sure what else you can do, short of
a real cleaning (naphtha or a pro hat cleaning).

 

[Marc Chevalier]

Lots of eBay sellers -- especially those who deal in "collectibles" -- are retired, disabled, sick, etc.


eBay helps them to get by. It also gives them something to do from home.


I've known more than a few eBay sellers who were in poor health.



.

 

[Rick Blaine]

White gas, Coleman fuel, naptha, all will clean the hat w/o damage & I assure you no odor will remain.

 

[tonyb]

I second feltfan's suggestion. But keep an eye on it. It's possible, but not likely, that exposure to strong sunlight could fade it. But I'd imagine it would take a quite prolonged period -- more like months than weeks -- for that to happen.
If it were mine, I'd clean it anyway, in naphtha, which, besides removing certain soiling, would go some way toward killing whatever spores might be lurking in the hat. Or so I would think, anyway.
If you've never used naphtha before, well, consult the archives here before diving in. There are a few precautions to follow, which mostly fall under the common-sense heading.
I'm certainly no expert, but I can tell you that despite that I have successfully cleaned several vintage lids in naphtha and I've yet to regret it.
Some people swear by some stuff called Febreeze, but I don't have enough experience with it to say either way.

Oh, by the way ... Seeing how you weighed in here, Rick, wasn't it you who had a hat-cleaning go terribly wrong a few months back? The sweatband gave up a bunch of dye, which transferred to the felt, as I recall. If that was indeed your misfortune, could you spare the rest of us a similar experience by reiterating what you used and why you suspect it went wrong?
I can offer, through bitter experience, that you shouldn't use paint thinner, as it dissolves certain plastics and its odor lingers in the felt. Naphtha does neither, as far as I can tell.

 

[Rick Blaine]

Oh, by the way ... Seeing how you weighed in here, Rick, wasn't it you who had a hat-cleaning go terribly wrong a few months back? The sweatband gave up a bunch of dye, which transferred to the felt, as I recall. If that was indeed your misfortune, could you spare the rest of us a similar experience by reiterating what you used and why you suspect it went wrong?
I can offer, through bitter experience, that you shouldn't use paint thinner, as it dissolves certain plastics and its odor lingers in the felt. Naphtha does neither, as far as I can tell.

OH YEAH, It was a bloody disaster, a sad tale to relate... a lovely white Royal stetson western made in Spain under licence to JBS went from this:

sadly, to this:

However so ever, do not let this disuade you from using white gas...had I but checked beneath the sweatband I would've seen a sooty black precipitate that was what ended up trashing the felt. This may have been one of two things; either it was mold/fungus of some sort or, more likely, this was a 'smoke cured' leather sweat and that substance was indeed soot, certainly looked like soot, anyway... I dunno WHAT it was, but it royaly screwed up a rare & lovely thin ribbon... so I shipped it off to Fedora in Mississippi, but what with his good fortune re: IJ IV, I do not expect tp get it back anytime soon... if indeed he can salvage it at all. BUT this is the only one of over a dozen lids that has ever been neg. affected by a white gas bath.... I continue to use it, thusfar without further disaster, but you had better know I do a more comprehensive examination now...

sadder but wiser,

RB

 

[Tango Yankee]

Oy vey. I remember that story. It still sends chills down my spine!

Make sure the sweatband itself is in good condition. If not, remove it. (General suggestion-yours looks to be in good shape, Dumbjaw.) I didn't in the last hat I gave a naptha bath, and it fairly disintegrated. It was a black sweat, too. Fortunately the hat itself was dark so no harm done, but I did have to filter the naptha a couple of times using coffee filters to get all the particles out.

I dunno if it would work or not, but I've got a Stetson bowler that smells badly of cigarette smoke. I've got one of those Arm and Hammer baking soda refridgerator odor killers that I'm going to put in a plastic bag with the bowler to see if that helps. Matter of fact, now that I'm thinking about it, I'm going to go do it right now. I'll let you know in a day or two if it helps.

Even if it does with mine, might not with your problem. Moldy odors can be difficult to deal with.

Cheers,
Tom

 

[feltfan]

How do you guys store naptha safely?
How do you dispose of it? What container
do you use to soak the hat?

Those questions keep me from trying it.
I could blow my whole house up while
relaxing with a cigar...

 

[HamletJSD]

My first thought was similar to Tango ...
Seal it up in a bag with baking soda and/or a desiccant (such as DampRid) for a few days or even a week. It might not work, but it would be a much less invasive thing to try first

 

[J.T.Marcus]

I know, those who have never tried it cringe at the thought, but it has worked for several of us. (It's also the simplest and safest). Run a sink full of COLD water with about three squirts of dish detergent (or WOOLITE, if you prefer). Remove the liner. Soak the liner for about 30 minutes, then rinse in cold water and hang to dry. Then soak the hat in the detergent water for 30-60 minutes, turning occasionally. Next soak the hat to rinse, in clear cold water (You might want to do this twice.). Shape the wet hat the way you want it to look, and hang it on the kitchen sink spout to dry. (Hint: If you have a front pinch, put the front of the sweatband touching the spout. If you hang it by the back, you will end up with a "bump" in the back of the crown.) When it stops dripping, try it on and do your final "blocking." It will take two days to dry completely. Try it on as often as you can. Until it dries, it will smell like a wet rabbit (or beaver, or sheep), but by the third day there should be no odor.

 

[LEUII]

I wonder how well that would work with our humidity. Unless we run a dehumidifier it would probably take so long to dry that a new batch of mildew/mold might just set in

 

[J.T.Marcus]

LEUII, When I lived in Aransas Pass, Texas, on the Gulf Coast, it took about a half day longer to dry!

 

[Tango Yankee]

How do you guys store naptha safely?
How do you dispose of it? What container
do you use to soak the hat?

Those questions keep me from trying it.
I could blow my whole house up while
relaxing with a cigar...

My naptha came in metal half gallon containers, but I keep it in a plastic five gallon gasoline container. I use a large plastic storage container to soak the hat. It's definitely an out in the garage thing, though. It has a strong odor to it; funny that something that strong dries odorless!

I've not tried disposing of mine yet; haven't used it very often and I filter it between uses. It's expensive stuff.

Cheers,
Tom

 

[nulty]

If the odor is as wretched as you say and there is evidence of water infiltration through the box then it seems the best way is to leave it in a hot sun for a few days as Feltfan suggested...

The issue with that is a hat that black Might run the risk of a fade if left out over a long period. Fading is a process so slow you don't notice until it's to late....believe me on that.....

I've not used white gas as I haven't had the need to though I don't know it as a mold killer.

 

[nulty]

p.s.

Also wanted to mention that the hat may have had some shrinkage evidenced by the appearance of a slight wrinkle in the sweat....

Smell and that aside , it's a gorgeous hat....

 

[Weatherman]

Smell

I'm relatively new to vintage hats and this forum, but I have used Fabreze Free Nature, unscented spray and it works great for that moldy, musty smell some vintage hats wear. I am an avid hunter and have used "Dead Down Wind" and other odor neutralizers on my hunting hats and clothing for years with no damage. This Fabreze is essentially the same thing. Set the spray at it's lowest (most misty) level and lightly spray the hat inside and out. DO NOT OVER SPRAY TO THE POINT IT IS SOAKED!!! Store the hat properly to allow it to dry and this might solve your issue. If you are nervous, I'd suggest testing on a less expensive, less favorite hat.