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TheGuitarFairy

Practically Family
Messages
608
Location
Just West of Boston
Incoming.
Wondering age of this Resistol?
Not sure if I've seen an unlined Resistol before.
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Steve1857

I'll Lock Up
Messages
8,829
Location
Denmark
Messages
19,409
Location
Funkytown, USA
Messages
19,001
Location
Central California
This hat got me thinking. Mark @M Hatman researched Beaver Brand and put its genesis in 1980 (the company existed before this, but under a different name(s)). This 100% beaver hat was a $25 hat. The inflation calculator says that $25 in 1980 is equivalent to $83 today. You sure can’t get a 100% beaver western hat today for $83. Has the cost of hat gone up several times the rate of inflation? Less price pressure due to less competition? Raw materials cost more? Increased labor costs?


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Even if the 1980 date is off, inflation alone doesn’t seem to explain the costs of today’s hats compared to the costs decades ago.
 
Messages
10,832
Location
vancouver, canada
This hat got me thinking. Mark @M Hatman researched Beaver Brand and put its genesis in 1980 (the company existed before this, but under a different name(s)). This 100% beaver hat was a $25 hat. The inflation calculator says that $25 in 1980 is equivalent to $83 today. You sure can’t get a 100% beaver western hat today for $83. Has the cost of hat gone up several times the rate of inflation? Less price pressure due to less competition? Raw materials cost more? Increased labor costs?


View attachment 354443 View attachment 354444 View attachment 354445 View attachment 354446

Even if the 1980 date is off, inflation alone doesn’t seem to explain the costs of today’s hats compared to the costs decades ago.
The base cost for my materials to make a hat runs from $80 to $100, rabbit to beaver. But that is buying felt in small quantity, vintage ribbon, best quality sweats. Surely a mass produced hat company is buying a lot better than I or other custom hatters. So the base material cost for these mass producers on a pure beaver hat, generic ribbon, middle of the road sweats??? What maybe $60 or less?
 
Messages
19,409
Location
Funkytown, USA
The base cost for my materials to make a hat runs from $80 to $100, rabbit to beaver. But that is buying felt in small quantity, vintage ribbon, best quality sweats. Surely a mass produced hat company is buying a lot better than I or other custom hatters. So the base material cost for these mass producers on a pure beaver hat, generic ribbon, middle of the road sweats??? What maybe $60 or less?

Plus: labor costs (including fringe), site costs (rent, property taxes, maintenance of property and equipment), marketing, regulatory compliance, and various other things a table top or even custom hatter may not have to deal with.

But, yeah, materials alone doesn't account for it. I wonder what the cost per unfinished hood is for a large company that felts their own blanks like Stetson or Akubra.
 
Messages
19,001
Location
Central California
Thanks, Robert. I have the related question about custom hat costs. It seems that the work (blocking, pouncing, ironing, sewing, etc.) is the same regardless of the type of felt. The materials (thread, leather sweatband, liner, ribbon) are all the same and the only difference is in the cost of the felt. However, it’s almost an industry wide practice of western hatters to price beaver blend hats twice that of rabbit/hare and the price doubles again if you want 100% beaver. I expect to pay more, but why is the same $250 hat in rabbit an $850 hat in beaver? The profit margins on the beaver hats are huge compared to rabbit…the costs of the hat bodies accounts for a tiny portion of the added expense.

I guess if those hatters are several months behind in orders there isn’t any pressure to lower their prices, but then why even offer rabbit/hare? I’ve always been curious and it’s not really a question you can ask the big name hatters.

Gannon, Northwest, Wolfbrae, and some others buck the trend and that’s why they get my business.
 
Messages
19,409
Location
Funkytown, USA
Thanks, Robert. I have the related question about custom hat costs. It seems that the work (blocking, pouncing, ironing, sewing, etc.) is the same regardless of the type of felt. The materials (thread, leather sweatband, liner, ribbon) are all the same and the only difference is in the cost of the felt. However, it’s almost an industry wide practice of western hatters to price beaver blend hats twice that of rabbit/hare and the price doubles again if you want 100% beaver. I expect to pay more, but why is the same $250 hat in rabbit an $850 hat in beaver? The profit margins on the beaver hats are huge compared to rabbit…the costs of the hat bodies accounts for a tiny portion of the added expense.

I guess if those hatters are several months behind in orders there isn’t any pressure to lower their prices, but then why even offer rabbit/hare? I’ve always been curious and it’s not really a question you can ask the big name hatters.

Gannon, Northwest, Wolfbrae, and some others buck the trend and that’s why they get my business.

I've seen jewelry marked up 100% - 1,000%. Nothing surprises me.
 
Messages
10,832
Location
vancouver, canada
Plus: labor costs (including fringe), site costs (rent, property taxes, maintenance of property and equipment), marketing, regulatory compliance, and various other things a table top or even custom hatter may not have to deal with.

But, yeah, materials alone doesn't account for it. I wonder what the cost per unfinished hood is for a large company that felts their own blanks like Stetson or Akubra.
Yes, other than my hard material costs (and the one time capital costs) I have none of the other attendant costs. Well, I guess a bit of electricity. But if Winchester is selling its beaver felts for $70 how much would Stratton pay for same? To me it is a wonder that Akubra can sell their hats for such a low price.....and Stetson ask so much for theirs
 
Messages
19,001
Location
Central California
I've seen jewelry marked up 100% - 1,000%. Nothing surprises me.


When I see a 60% off sale sign in a jewelry store window I always wonder why everyone doesn’t get pissed knowing what a screw job their normal prices are. Even at their sale prices they are rip-offs. There’s a local store that guarantees that their jewelry will appraise for twice what they sell it for…what good is such an appraisal? Nope, I’m sticking with hats.
 
Messages
19,409
Location
Funkytown, USA
Yes, other than my hard material costs (and the one time capital costs) I have none of the other attendant costs. Well, I guess a bit of electricity. But if Winchester is selling its beaver felts for $70 how much would Stratton pay for same? To me it is a wonder that Akubra can sell their hats for such a low price.....and Stetson ask so much for theirs

I guess it's just the brand. Kinda like Louis Vuitton handbags. Or Ray-Ban sunglasses.

When I see a 60% off sale sign in a jewelry store window I always wonder why everyone doesn’t get pissed knowing what a screw job their normal prices are. Even at their sale prices they are rip-offs. There’s a local store that guarantees that their jewelry will appraise for twice what they sell it for…what good is such an appraisal? Nope, I’m sticking with hats.

I was nominally involved in retail jewelry sales many moons ago, and was really taken aback.
 
Messages
12,005
Location
Southern California
I guess it's just the brand. Kinda like Louis Vuitton handbags. Or Ray-Ban sunglasses...
Spot on. Way back when we were still dating my wife and I took a class in basic auto repair and maintenance. The instructor was a former auto mechanic for various General Motors dealerships (and all of the brand names under their umbrella of ownership) and he told us flat out that if two customers drove in on the same day with the same maintenance request that the customer with the Cadillac was going to pay five to ten times more than the customer with the Chevy even though the maintenance procedures were essentially identical. Why? The name badge on each vehicle. Cadillac was still a big deal back in the late-70s/early-80s, and if you could afford one the retail/service logic was that you could afford to pay more to maintain it. So, yep, quite often you're/we're paying more for the name.
 

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